# French Social Security and Public Sector Jobs: Sarah Knafo Debate - Original post: https://www.twitter.com/i/status/2116426132199559674 - Source account: [@Namkaribou](https://x.com/Namkaribou) - Source language: French - Target language: English - Duration: 5:13 - Published: 2026-11-01 - Machine translated. Check the original before quoting. - Canonical URL: https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate - Original-language version: https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/fr/s%C3%A9curit%C3%A9-sociale-et-fonctionnaires-le-d%C3%A9bat-avec-sarah-knafo.md ## Transcript [0:00](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate) I've heard everything you're saying about Nicolas footing the bill. [0:02](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=2) I think either you don't really understand how the system works, or you're not entirely honest. Uh, if we look at who gets what and who funds what in France. [0:14](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=14) Uh, the, one of the, one of the departments that contributes the most and that is nevertheless the poorest in France, Seine-Saint-Denis contributes the most to Social Security, ranking eighth. [0:23](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=23) That's convenient. Yeah. One of the biggest contributors, then. [0:26](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=26) And, and, and the department that receives the most per capita is Var. So this idea that it is the middle classes that fund the poor is actually completely false. [0:33](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=33) Include pensions, I think, in your calculation. [0:35](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=35) Yeah. It's Social Security. You talked a lot about pensions. [0:38](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=38) There are a lot of retirees in the Var. Our system is a system of solidarity. [0:41](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=41) That skews the calculation. The people who work fund retirees, and healthy people fund the sick. [0:47](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=47) It's our system, and it's a system that is very important for the, for the population. So today, calling this system into question requires saying what we're going to replace it with. [0:57](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=57) And the alternative, is the private American alternative, where people's life expectancy is declining for the first time in a wealthy country, outside a period of war, where the, the wealth produced, uh, by, devoted to health care, is 17 percent of GDP in the United States, [1:15](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=75) then that we are at 12 percent and roughly in line with the rest of our neighbors. [1:19](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=79) Um, and so, um, um, it, it has to be said to, to, to to your potential voters that your plan is a plan to split the society, leading toward something, an American system. [1:32](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=92) Mr. Millon, let her respond, if I may. We understand your point of view. Let Sara respond, Knafo. [1:38](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=98) So, at the risk of surprising you, I agreed with the entire first part of your remarks. Unfortunately, you put too much ideology and politics into the second part, but as for the first part, I agree with everything you said. I absolutely do not want to reduce the number of civil servants [1:52](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=112) at the hospital, and I think you haven't read what I've written. [1:54](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=114) So, I'll give you my book. To be clear, you haven't read me. [1:57](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=117) So, what I say about the number of civil servants, to answer point by point, today, we have 5.9 million civil servants in France. [2:03](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=123) I am indeed proposing to eliminate 800 thousand positions, and I say everywhere else than in hospitals, the police, the gendarmerie, the military, etc. [2:10](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=130) I cite the roles that are essential, which are our public services. [2:14](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=134) But those roles represent only 2.2 million of the five .9 million. So, you can well imagine there are many others. [2:20](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=140) But which public services? Do you want me to list them for you? [2:23](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=143) Yeah, for example. If you want, if you like examples, I can give you some. [2:26](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=146) We're not going to list them all, but… I can give you a few. [2:28](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=148) A few, since I think the gentleman, like me, likes facts. facts. [2:31](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=151) He's a scientist. We'll mention a few. There are now 26,869 people who work at Bercy, on individual taxation, whereas tax returns are, are now filed automatically and all the cross-checking of data could make it possible to reduce this number of civil servants. [2:45](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=165) You have 20,631 people— It could make it possible to fight tax fraud, which is roughly a hundred times greater than—than social security fraud, for example. [2:51](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=171) We could, we could use them that way. And they're used that way, right? [2:54](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=174) No more private individuals. Here, it's companies. [2:56](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=176) Absolutely. We'll, we'll get there. We'll get there. We'll get there, sir. [2:59](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=179) They're already fighting it, aren't they? Don't you think that with these new tools, with artificial intelligence, which I hope you use in your daily life too, don't you think we can manage to achieve more with fewer people? [3:09](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=189) I don't think the general message is to say there are too many civil servants in the country, for example. So, today, I think that in terms of health, you understand that there is mortality. [3:19](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=199) I just said I excluded health. I think that's your field of expertise. [3:22](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=202) No, no, no. I know a few others. The, the, maternal and child health service, for example, which is, which is funded by the department. So, are you going to continue to allocate a specific budget to the, the, maternal and child health service, [3:34](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=214) knowing that today, we have a shameful increase in infant mortality? [3:38](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=218) I'll try to answer fully. Then let her answer, sir, if you'll allow her to. [3:42](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=222) I just told you that health was not concerned. [3:44](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=224) However, what I'm saying and why I was saying I agreed with you, you initially said, "I'm very committed to public service." [3:50](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=230) That's good, so am I. And I think that when you're committed to public service, then you must fight bureaucracy. [3:55](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=235) Bureaucracy, is the opposite of public service. [3:58](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=238) That's what prevents the service from being provided to the public. [4:01](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=241) And since you're in the field of health, let me give you a single example. Our employee takes home two thousand euros a month. [4:07](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=247) Throughout his life, he has paid four hundred thirty- nine euros a month for his health care. [4:11](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=251) At the end of his career, he will have paid 225,000 euros, and we are going to make him believe he lives in a country where health care is free. [4:18](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=258) First piece of information for the public: healthcare isn't free. [4:21](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=261) Once we've said that, is it appropriate to have a health insurance policy? [4:24](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=264) Yes, I'm not saying we should get rid of it. [4:27](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=267) My example, my, what I cite in my book, is absolutely not the American model. Do you know what my example is? [4:32](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=272) It's a public hospital, it's Valenciennes Hospital, it's a French hospital. That's the example I cite. [4:38](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=278) It's a hospital that gave power back to its doctors to fight the bureaucracy. Do you like that example? [4:42](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=282) Do you like— No. Valenciennes Hospital, we've heard reports about it, actually, it's the model student that uses activity-based pricing, chooses its activities and that, that, that, to be a model student, tends to depart from the spirit of public service. [4:53](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=293) Voted best hospital in France. People travel miles to go get treated there. You have doctors who are happy today and who say: We wouldn't change the system for anything in the world. [5:02](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=302) We haven't heard quite the same thing. I speak to their doctor. You're right, I'm still not talking to union representatives. [5:06](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=306) We're not going to debate this particular hospital. I'd simply like to. [5:10](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EbVwIx09sQxQ/en/french-social-security-and-public-sector-jobs-sarah-knafo-debate?t=310) I speak to doctors.