# Douglas Murray and Fatima Debate a Niqab Ban in Britain

- Original post: https://www.twitter.com/i/status/2114873294432391586
- Source account: [@SharronMcKenna5](https://x.com/SharronMcKenna5)
- Source language: English
- Duration: 3:39
- Published: 2026-11-07
- Canonical URL: https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain

## Transcript

[0:00](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain) Do you understand that many people feel this is divisive?

[0:02](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=2) It is a curtain between you and the rest of society. Well, to be quite frank, I think people are free to feel how they want.

[0:05](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=5) It does, I don't care how you feel. But, but what I say tonight, what Yasmin says, and other people say tonight, people see our faces. They know who said it.

[0:11](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=11) I'm sorry to say this, but nobody knows who you are.

[0:13](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=13) They can hear your name. They can't see you.

[0:15](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=15) Fatima- If I say something stupid on television tonight, people know it's me saying it.

[0:18](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=18) If you do, with all due respect, you can disappear and no one knows.

[0:21](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=21) She's a new name. We're not disappearing.

[0:22](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=22) That was Douglas Murray, the only man on the panel, in a hall in East London packed with women in face veils.

[0:28](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=28) Channel 4 put one question to them live on air: should the niqab be banned in Britain?

[0:32](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=32) Against him sit three women who wear it, including a community activist.

[0:36](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=36) Over the next 20 minutes, he'll be told it's just a piece of cloth, that most communication doesn't need a face, and that how the country feels doesn't matter.

[0:43](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=43) Then he asks one question about an airport, and the whole case starts to fall apart.

[0:47](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=47) It starts with a poll. Can I just begin with you, Fatima? Yes.

[0:51](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=51) 56% of British people don't really support the wearing of the full face veil in public. They don't want it.

[0:58](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=58) Uh, well, I think it depends on where you, where you take the poll, really.

[1:01](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=61) Because, um, well, uh, something that I've recently launched is a project called Secrets of a Muslim Woman, and it's all about letting people know, uh, why we do what we do.

[1:09](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=69) Because I think a lot of it is to do with not really being familiar with it.

[1:12](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=72) You know, I mean, uh, I mean, my message to the British public is that you've got nothing to fear.

[1:16](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=76) You know, it's a piece of cloth. But they don't feel that though, do they?

[1:18](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=78) Because elsewhere in this po- poll, a majority said they don't know how to relate- You know what?

[1:21](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=81) ... to a woman wearing a full face veil. I think, you know, the people who have actually interacted with women who wear the face veil, people who work with them, I mean, we're in East London today.

[1:29](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=89) In East London, the veil is practically, you know, normal on the streets of, of East London.

[1:33](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=93) Uh, people who've actually interacted and worked with w- women who wear the veil have absolutely no problem with it.

[1:37](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=97) Douglas Murray- I think it's the fear of the unknown ...

[1:38](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=98) Douglas Murray, would you like to see the ve- the veil banned here?

[1:41](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=101) Well, I think like a, a majority of British people, I think that it should be banned in public places, particularly places like courtrooms, where it's absolutely imperative- But what about an overall ban? ... that a jury are able to see the faces of, uh, people who are accused. As for an overall ban, I think, look,

[1:52](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=112) uh, my own opinion is the niqab is highly undesirable.

[1:55](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=115) I think that we live in a society where people do show their faces, where huge amounts of our social interaction depend on people showing their faces.

[2:01](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=121) I think that it's very difficult to enforce a ban in public places like streets, but it should be a certainly a desirable thing to discourage its wearing.

[2:08](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=128) So difficult to impose a ban, but in principle, you'd like to see one because you think in Britain it's unacceptable.

[2:12](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=132) In, in public buildings, in courts, in schools, in places like this, absolutely, I think a ban would be, uh, very sensible.

[2:16](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=136) In streets and so on, I think it's difficult, but it should be societally discouraged.

[2:20](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=140) 56% of the country doesn't want the full face veil in public, and the first answer is, "It depends where you take the poll."

[2:26](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=146) Then, "You've got nothing to fear." So an objection becomes a fear, and the fear is the public's problem.

[2:32](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=152) Murray's answer is calmer than his reputation.

[2:34](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=154) Courtrooms, because a jury has to see the accused.

[2:37](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=157) Schools, public buildings. On the street, discourage it.

[2:40](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=160) Don't ban it. Most of Britain already agrees with that.

[2:43](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=163) Now listen to the reply and one sentence in it that's going to matter later.

[2:47](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=167) Fatima? No, a ban, I mean, I think it's a complete overreaction.

[2:50](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=170) Look, the niqab has been part of the British landscape for the last 20-odd years, okay?

[2:54](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=174) Muslim women have been going about their business.

[2:56](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=176) We've got a radio presenter here. We've got a scientist.

[2:58](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=178) We've got talented Muslim women who've got a lot to give to this society, who've been doing so and been very sensible about it.

[3:03](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=183) But it's- When we need to remove our face veils, we do it.

[3:05](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=185) But- How do you think we get through airport security?

[3:06](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=186) But, Sahra, I mean, what, what about the fact that 56% of people are saying they don't want it here? You know what?

[3:10](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=190) I'm not surprised at all because when you know that high-profile politicians making such, uh, uh, uh- Fuss ... offensive comment, comments and big fuss about it, I am not surprised- But Douglas Murray is right ... the public say they are against it ... in British society. "When we need to remove our face veils, we do it.

[3:21](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=201) But Douglas Murray is right ... the public say they are against it ... in British society. "When we need to remove our face veils, we do it.

[3:25](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=205) How do you think we get through airport security?"

[3:27](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=207) Hold on to that because Murray will. And the 56%?

[3:30](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=210) Blame the politicians, apparently. The public didn't make up its own mind.

[3:34](https://www.translate.mom/transcript/EqFmDAQ8hhCA/en/douglas-murray-and-fatima-debate-a-niqab-ban-in-britain?t=214) Then the community activist, Sahra El Faifi, takes over, and the argument gets stranger