Urdu → English transcript

It applies to mosque members, and there he tells people this.

Meaning, those four percent have control over every mosque member.

And he tells me to reflect a little on my tolerance.

Non-Muslims are not the only kafirs. According to the Deobandis, Barelvis are kafir.

In the Barelvi view, Deobandis are kafir. According to both of them, the Ahl-e-Hadith are kafir.

All three consider Shias kafir, and all four have declared the Ahmadis outside the fold.

Please reflect on your own attitudes. Final two questions, Arif Sahib.

The biggest point is that when you mention communism and conservatism

Fundamentalism — I'm not denying it at all.

It exists among Muslims and among other communities as well. The difference is this:

is that the clergy you are referring to have

no support at the level right now. For the moment, those who believe in Hindutva politics

think that our government, which is the largest political party,

has a firm hold over the whole country; in the entire parliament, they...

Most of them are from the president; their patronage comes directly from him.

They're mixed, yet you yourself keep saying that Deobandi is the threat to you.

I did not say that the threat from Deoband is greater than the threat from Nagpur.

I didn't say that. Tell me — I didn't say it was from Nagpur.

Being a journalist doesn't mean you put words in my mouth.

One-line question: is the threat greater from Deoband?

I already told you earlier that the threat is greater from Nagpur. I

can fight my own selfishness; against someone else's selfishness

Allah has not given me the strength to fight that. If you want to understand

then understand. And I clearly remember that on your Facebook

you had posted "I'll play Holi, Bismillah."

What people have written against you I remember very well; I read all those

comments. Where did this intolerance come from, and of this intolerance's

What will the reaction be? I told you I haven't renounced conservatism.

It's not that this exists in every community, but we will attack others.

We make excuses; we are not willing to look at our own wrongdoing.

We won't do that because it's very easy — for God's sake — to point a finger.

When you raise one finger at someone else,

four fingers point back at you.